Food or more oomph?

[cutemangurdi1]

Kia is dropping a bit of weight and I think she seems tired after her exercise. She is on 2kg of A&P fast fibre a day plus haylage and out in the day time. I've just bought soya oil to add to her feed, but wondered if there are any other feeds that would not heat her up, but might give her more energy? Her coat looks good and shiny and her feet are great, I'm just conscious she is ridden 4 to 5 times a week, sometimes intensively and she is still growing, so I want to make sure her nutritional needs are well catered for.
Thanks

[harveydales]

As she's still growing and in work, I would put her on full rations of one of the good Balancers if you are going to keep her on the FF. I have my "field onrnaments" on FF with some added linseed plus ad lib hay which keeps them right but for Harvey, I've been converted to Winergy. He is on the Senior and I think every one who has seen him will say he is looking and feeling superb. I know it is expensive, but if I had a youngster, I would consider Winery Growth which is equally low in starch and sugars but has everything a growing and workding youngster needs.

I know a lot of people on here use Baileys and other feed manufacturers so I'm sure you will get plenty of advice.

[zeldalithgow]

It is natural for them to drop weight in winter, it helps to prevent them getting laminitis in the summer as it helps keep the metabolism right - not that I'm saying you shouldn't up/change her feed

What I should have said was it is good for them to drop a bit in winter

[Anna]

I think if they are in decent work like Kia they need extra, I don't find dales big eaters at all in terms of hard feed but you can initially just use a balancer like harveydales suggest and then add even something like conditioning cubes. They work reasonably well although she might need something more aimed at a working horse if she is tiring easily. I'm not adverse to feeding an endurance mix or the Dobson and horrel stay power cubes at the recommended levels to those in work.

[Anna]

I should say I find neither are fizzy heating but provide slow releasing energy to aid stamina

[flintfootfilly]

If she's still growing, I wouldn't be exercising her intensively at all. I'd ease off on the work, and just do relatively slow work and short duration until she's fully matured.

I'd also be wary of feeding Fast Fibre. Allen & Page insist on continuing marketing it as being suitable as a partial or total hay replacer, and yet if fed as a total hay replacer the level of selenium would be way above supposedly "safe" levels. FF has a declared 0.88mg/kg of selenium, so if fed as a total hay replacer that would be 8.8mg selenium a day for a 500kg pony. The supposed upper limit for dietary selenium if 5mg/kg DM, and I suspect that level is actually too high in any case.

Also, IMHO FF just doesn't stack up as a vit/min source. Whilst it may provide an appropriate level of selenium if it's fed at just a kg or two a day, the vitamin E levels are incredibly low - only 100iu/kg of the feed (as opposed to 500iu per day recommended for maintenance, 800mg recommended for growth and around 1500iu per day suggested for work - NRC figures).

So if you're feeding vits/mins or a balancer as well as the FF, I'd definitely ditch the FF. If you're not feeding a vit/min or balancer, then I'd definitely want to start on a reputable one. Worth having a word with one of the good nutritionists like either Nicola Tyler at Topspec or Teresa Hollands at Dodson & Horrell as they'll be able to suggest what might work best for your pony.

Sarah

[heathera]

I'd echo the thought that if she's still growing and is tired after exercise and dropping weight I'd ease off on the workload rather than up her feed. You'll hopefully have 20 years of riding from her if you ease into it slowly.

Be aware that soya oil is also unbalanced in the omega 3 to 6 ratio. It's better to feed linseed.

[DalesLady]

Speaking from experience, linseed oil can make some ponies fizzy and soya oil can make them itchy... we have had both scenarios, so be careful.

We try to keep it very simple when feeding our ponies and although I am not as scientific about it as some, I do rate Baileys conditioning cubes for those who are working and Baileys lo-cal for those who are doing less. Feed it at the rate on the bag and add extra chaff in between if you think she could do with it. It can be useful to split feeds into smaller amounts so they are fed the same amount over more feeds, meaning they will should absorb more from the total amount.
We use Graze-on or Readigrass as a base for ours. Some people don't like this because it has a higher protein percentage than things like alfa-a or hifi-lite, but we have not had any problem with it and actually it is the whole point if you have a pony struggling to hold weight. Its a great grass replacer.

You do say Kia is turned out during the day (lucky pony:)), has she got plenty of grass out there and perhaps it may be good to put a little hay/hayage out with her, because I dn't think there is much goodness in the grass at the moment. If she chooses not to eat it if you do put it out, then don't waste any more, but may be worth a try.

[harleydales]

I too would cut back on the work - I always give youngsters a break through the winter, to grow and think about what they've done through the year. Lady will be 8 this year - I started her late in her 4th year, turned her away, worked her gently through her 5th and 6th years, and turned her away in the winter, and her 7th year was her first real working year. She did well, but by the end of October was a bit ragged and I knew she needed a break so turned her away again. She's a bit different because of her background, but Dales are slow maturing and I do feel they need time to grown and develop both physically and mentally.

Oil is very good for stamina, but instead of wasting money on expensive stuff I would use supermarket vegetable oil - that's what Harley gets all year round and it works prefectly well for a quarter of the price. To balance it I use Opti Muscle from Feedmark.

Grass is purely gut fill at the moment, there is no goodness in it at all so I would be giving a bit of hay or barley straw through the day too.

Grass nuts are great for weight gain.

[cutemangurdi1]

Thanks everyone. i will investigate oil winergy, endurance feed and balancers. I can't put hay in the field as she is on full livery and we are not allowed to do that, but she gets plenty roughage. I don't think she is doing excessive work but is naturally to the lazy end of a Dales! She isn't bum high or anything, but I think what she is on probably doesn't match her workload well any longer. She will get time off once bad weather hits us which is usually late Jan, so I want to keep her in work until then as she actually enjoys it and it helps her to mind her manners!