Ponies on pergolide

[NFK Dumpling]

James has been diagnosed as suffering from Cushings after a blood test just before Easter and the Vet has prescribed Prascend - a brand of pergolide.

Has anyone posted anything since Harveydales' Quest 3 months on (below) as I would be interested to hear how you have managed the condition? I have tried the search posts but keep getting somewhat random results which don't feature pergolide

I have been advised to either fit a grazing muzzle, construct a bare paddock or keep him in - the last of which I consider would be particularly cruel as he also suffers from stiffness (probably arthritis) and has been free to roam for the last 14 years.

[harveydales]

Sorry to hear about James but good that you've got a diagnosis and have him on Pergolide. It really isn't all doom and gloom and there is a lot of new thinking about laminitis and its causes in general. I haven't been keeping up with it all but am hoping to listen in to the Liphook online talk on Cushings and Laminitis this Wednesday (April 10th) : www.talkaboutlaminitis.co.uk/ Might be worth you logging in too.

There are a number of Yahoo groups and Facebook Groups dealing specifically with Cushings/Laminitis management. I used to look in but it does become rather mindboggling. I do agree with you that restricting Jame's turnout at his age would not be the best idea. Looking into grazing muzzles would be sensible. I never did that with Quest because our grazing was too sparse anyway.

I think there have been a few members with CUshings/Lami ponies on Pergolide but the only one who springs to mind immediately is Nancy's Topaz who I believe is still going strong after many years on Pergolide.

[NFK Dumpling]

Thanks Pam

My friend's arab/welsh x who has had Cushing's for a while is turned out on a hardcore yard but I don't think that I can do that to my field so I guess a grazing muzzle is the best answer. She was diagnosed because she had severe laminitis but James has avoided it so far - he just has very odd deposits of fat on his neck and rump.

I am hoping to log on to the webinar on Weds, hopefully it will be recorded if I miss it.

[cadeby]

Have a chat with Lucy. Her mare Choc is on pergolide (or an equivalent - can't remember exactly which drug). She doesn't get on here very often so may miss this post.

Good luck to James. I hope it doesn't change his unique character

[cadeby]

I would also pm Emily (mickey on here). With her pharmacy credentials she'll be able to advise re. the cheapest option. I bet the prices have changed since Quest's thread?

[Deleted]

Hi, I usually lurk the board reading all the updates of dales pony fun but thought I had to respond to this. My 22yr old dales mare, Emily was diagnosed with Cushings 6 years ago, following a summer of persistent laminitis. She started on Pergolide as this was available at the time and within 6 weeks was a different pony, began to lose weight and laminitis free. She was allowed out in a smaller fenced off area in the field and by the following spring was coming back into light work.
Because of arthritis and COPD she has since then lived out for 3 years, 24/7, brought in for a feed each day and hay given in the winter months. She has maintained her weight and is generally a condition score of 2.5 throughout the year, although she loses a bit in the winter. I've read it's common for Cushing's ponies to present with COPD when the cushing's is controlled as the excess steroid helps control the copd?
She is as lively and as fun as ever, leaping off in gallop on stubble fields instead of being the sensible older friend for younger ponies!
We switched to Prascend about 2 years ago and she's been fine on that. I get a prescription form the vet then good old Google to discover which of the online pharmacy have the best price, generally it's been about 85p per tablet and Em's been on 1mg since the start. She did have a couple of wobbly weeks at the beginning with low appetite and mood, apparently that's common as ponies adjust to the meds and can be lessened by half the dose for a few days.
So basically I don't really keep her much different to other ponies, sensible feeding- fibre based, low starch/sugars and feed to work (or in her case lack of- lol).
Good luck with James hopefully once you get him settled on the meds you'll start to see a difference in his fat distribution and he'll still be able to be out and about to keep the joints moving. It's not easy but it can be done!

[Fi]

I'd second these opinions. My 24-yr old was diagnosed about 4 years ago. He's now on 3.5 mg a day, and recently we moved onto Prascend as the old pergolide prices and availability got silly. I also get a vet prescription and google it myself, last lot was 86p a tablet (1mg), plus perscription fee. Can't remember who from, but I can look it up if you want me to?

I'm careful about his feed/turnout etc but not overly restrictive, our grazing is never really lush anyway, a muzzle might be the way to go if yours is - the Prascend should reduce the risk of lami if he's turned out, certainly Sam's not suffered from it sonce his first bout 4 years ago. He's also a bit arthritic, so I'd rather he was moving than not. Sam also had that classic 'pergolide veil' of going off his feed really badly, my advice would be to introduce the drug really slowly (1/4 of a tablet at a time) and build up to the recommended dose over a couple of weeks.

I used to read the yahoo forums - there's one run by Dr Eleanor Kellon (she's a real expert), and another called The Metabolic Horse that I used to like but like Harveydales says they are quite mind boggling and research still seems to be ongoing, so now I tend to just treat him as a lami risk and balance that with the quality/happiness of his life.

I hope you can get James settled into it OK, tbh when Sam was first diagnosed I felt it was a life sentence, but 4 years on he's still doing fine and I think his age and arthritis is more an issue now to any work he does than the Cushings. I get his bloods re-tested once or twice a year to check the dose is right. The Prascend is giving him some extra years that we wouldn't be getting otherwise.

[mickey]

Prascend is the licensed veterinary product so that's what has to be used now- worth asking vets for prices and looking on line, they can charge for a script though (with our vets its cheaper to get it through them than pay script cost then drug cost).
There are 2 on it at our yard- 1 who has been on it years, has a history of laminitis which she hasn't had since being on pergolide. She is out 24/7 with no muzzle- our grazing is not rich but in summer isn't none existant so she does get grass and is fine. Other mare is a 35 year old TB, history of COPD and laminitis, has had founderguard in the past for the lami however has recently been diagnosed with cushings and put on pergolide. Again she is out 24/7 on grass.
Does James have a history of lami? If he's been ok up to now, the prascend should decrease the lami risk not increase it as far as I know so I wouldn't be suddenly muzzling / bare paddock just because of a cushings diagnosis

[sck1]

Really sorry to hear about James' diagnosis. I haven't got any experience but just wanted to say hi!

[NFK Dumpling]

Thank you all for your messages, it has been very helpful

Apr 9, 2013 16:06:16 GMT -1 cadeby said:

Good luck to James. I hope it doesn't change his unique character

10 days into treatment I can report that it seems to be having no impact on James' "unique" character as he spontaneously erupted into canter on the gallops setting Musk off as he went (bless Natalie who only ever says " He's a bit strong today"...).

Apr 9, 2013 21:12:32 GMT -1 mickey said:

Does James have a history of lami? If he's been ok up to now, the prascend should decrease the lami risk not increase it as far as I know so I wouldn't be suddenly muzzling / bare paddock just because of a cushings diagnosis

No, to my knowledge he's never had laminitis. It was the vet who suggested muzzling him. I have restricted their grazing from the 3 acres now it is growing (at last!) and upped their hay a little to compensate. I will start my usual strip grazing and weight taping and keep an eye on his neck. Thank you.

Hi Suzanne - any improvement in Mr Blue as yet?

[NFK Dumpling]

Good news after 30days on Prascend and a blood test, James has stabilised at 0.5mg per day.

All of his fat pads have reduced, which now leaves me wondering if I need to get his saddle checked! He has recommenced bullying Musk who does a lot of yapping. We have even pursued a Landrover up the road (!?!)

[harveydales]

Really pleased to read this.

[flintfootfilly]

That all sounds good.

Megz, my 16yo, started on prascend a couple of months back after being footy for the last two summers (but being "normal" on the resting ACTH test) and then coming in only a few units below the cutoff point for the TRH stimulation of ACTH test this spring.

Apart from the footiness and growth rings on her feet despite a consistent diet, she had also become very lethargic and shut down and would often just stand on her own with her nose almost on the ground. The difference has been astonishing, and she decided to take up a new hobby which is playing colty games with her 8 year old son. My vet was also astonished by how much more active and cheeky she is. She is back to being herd leader again, and already her topline is looking better - she had started to look more like a typical cushing's horse with sway back, ewe neck etc.

Thumbs up for pergolide!

Sarah

[harveydales]

May 15, 2013 5:42:37 GMT -1 flintfootfilly said:

That all sounds good.

Megz, my 16yo, started on prascend a couple of months back after being footy for the last two summers (but being "normal" on the resting ACTH test) and then coming in only a few units below the cutoff point for the TRH stimulation of ACTH test this spring.

Apart from the footiness and growth rings on her feet despite a consistent diet, she had also become very lethargic and shut down and would often just stand on her own with her nose almost on the ground. The difference has been astonishing, and she decided to take up a new hobby which is playing colty games with her 8 year old son. My vet was also astonished by how much more active and cheeky she is. She is back to being herd leader again, and already her topline is looking better - she had started to look more like a typical cushing's horse with sway back, ewe neck etc.

Thumbs up for pergolide!

Sarah

That's great news, Sarah.

[cadeby]

It's lovely to hear that everyone's Cushings ponies are doing so well, and that James is back to his old tricks