Heather Moffett Saddles

[bellajack]

Hello everyone. I am new here and was looking at the threads on Heather Moffett saddles and felt that I had to ask "WHAT ABOUT THE FHOENIX SUBERPANEL?
In my opinion the Suberpanel could have been purpose made for the Dales Pony:
Extreme width - no problem and more feeling of twist than with the prolite.
Slipping - once girth tension is correct you could hang off one side Devil's Horseman style and it wont move.

The prolite Fhoenix is easily convertable - just remove prolite and put saddle onto suberpanel - fitting problems are history (on a wide horse anyway). I use mine on my 2 tabletops and a friends croup high ex broodmare with muscle wastage under seat and bridging problems in any other saddle. The cork fills in all the nooks and crannies - problem solved.

Ok, it might look a bit unconventional for showing but you can always replace the prolite for shows. It also looks like it sits you high up above the horse but it doesn't feel like it and I could really feel what their backs were doing for the 1st time when I 1st sat on one. Mine also respond to very subtle seat aids with the suber even though they are only babies.

The only types I could see the suber perhaps not suiting are bony, high withered TBs, and who would want to ride one of those if they could ride a Dales?

I apologise if this has been covered in a previous thread but I could see no mention of the Fhoenix Suberpanel and I personally would use nothing else on a Dales now and I am neurotic about saddles fitting properly.

[zeldalithgow]

Hi Bellajack welcome to Dales Fans we are a friendly helpful but everso slightly mad lot here, hope you enjoy it here - please tell us about yourself and ponies

I think a few Dales Fans have the HM Phoenix saddle I'm sure they will add a reply to this post when they see it

[knight]

Hi Bellajack & welcome! Zelda's right, it's friendly and positive on here and more than a little addictive, but in a good way! I definitely agree with you about the fhoenix suberpanel, it seems just made for our wide bodied Dales. I'd looked toward treeless after reading about the trials of so many on here with saddle fit and this with saddle fitters available in the UK. Where I am in the US saddle fitters are unknown and since I'm not knowledgable enough to really tell if a treed saddle fits just right treeless sounded like the way to go. But I found that treeless with no gullet didn't suit Knight well and so I got an early SBS when HM first came out with them. Worked great for Knight but did slip some. Knight voted for the suberpanel from the first time it was on his back and absolutely no slipping. I know some have found the fit of the formed panels to suit their ponies better, so it's great to have such options available. But then Knight is very, very wide & very, very flat backed. The formed do look more conventional but I hardly ever compete.

I hope you'll tell us about your ponies and pictures too please!

(Edited for my usual inability to spell.)

[harveydales]

Hello Bellajack and Welcome! Do tell us a bit about yourself and your ponies! It would be great to see some pics too.

I think there are quite a few of us here with HM saddles. I have a Fhoenix Prolite dressage saddle and love it. The suber version wasn't available when I got mine but, as you say, the Prolite models can be converted. The Prolite seems to suit Harvey fine but he isn't as flat backed as most Dales and does have some wither. Even so, I would be interested to try the suberpannel version for comparison.

[southerner]

I have had phoenix and sbs and hate both now I have a decent saddle again! The difference in the ponies is incredible, especialy fern who has been in an sbs for 4 years, so much happier in a normal saddle that fits well. I know a lot of people have them but I would not recommend them from personal experience.

[khristyne]

Thats interesting, southerner. It is nice to hear different views. My jury is out on treeless. The seat in both saddles is too small for me so I suspect i will never know!! I was considering an Ansur though.

[southerner]

My oh has a very nice close contact gel based fylde ray saddle which is an 18.5" which is not long with a 11.5" wide seat. Very comfy! Also amazingly classical in feel!

[PonyGirl]

I have an Ansur not that I can ride as Feather is in foal. (She isn't keen on riding now)

[greydales]

Well saddles are a personal thing and one saddle obviously won't suit all. I've had an SBS, a Fhoenix suberpanel and also a prolite. I found the Fhoenix to be one of the best saddles I've had (and I have been through MANY) - BUT it still isn't perfect.

I couldn't get on with the suberpanel and far prefer the prolite - the suberpanel tended to move forwards a little on both Saturn and Dancer.

I do find that while the Fhoenix is supremely comfortable sometimes I need a bit more support and have also invested in a Humphries and Swain semi flex WH - which has to be the best treed saddle I've ever had. I am extremely happy with these two saddles.

[bellajack]

I guess I am lucky that both my ponies are very up-hill, definately withers high. I have heard people say that the suber doesn't work so well on down hill conformation, but if anyone else has an up-hill Dales I can highly recommend it. I now have a prolite as well, though I only use it as a suber as the prolite just doesn't feel like home to me! Quite useful to have one that will do both though.

[southerner]

Our sbs was recently pressure tested by our saddler. All weight concentrated under the riders seat with no weight dispersal. Has been consigned to emergency saddle for very very light riders only!

[bellajack]

Isn't it strange, how saddlers who don't stock these saddles which need no specialist fitting or regular re-fitting/re-flocking, don't seem to like them very much. I wonder why that could be?

[SuzieP]

My guess is that they don't stock them because there isn't any stock to be had. Even direct from Heather there's a wait for delivery isn't there?

I'd also be very wary of a saddle that gives results like that in a pressure test. Having spoken to several very experienced horsemen, there's more than saddlers out there who don't like treeless for good, sound and well-thought out reasons.

Personally, I'm not comfortable riding on any SBS; and on a wide pony plus SBS I'm crippled because of my dikkihip.

[bellajack]

Well the SBS is obsolete now anyway, but all Heather's saddles undergo extensive computer pressure testing, using heavyweight riders, which presumably would be more accurate than anything a local saddler could come up with.

I did a lot of research before I bought my Fhoenix. I would never use a saddle that I didn't KNOW was perfectly safe and comfortable for my ponies. I think my ponies back muscles, and they are ridden in my Fhoenix daily, speak for themselves, along with the fact that, in spite of their youth, they have never once bucked when being ridden - ever, either of them!

Have a horrible feeling I shouldn't have said that. They will probably both buck me off tomorrow now!!!!!

Waterside Grace, who I have said can't canter, is now a pony who couldn't canter. She was schooled by a much better rider than me before her current owner bought her, but couldn't manage a balanced canter to save her life. I school her a couple of times a week, and I have one advantage over her former owner - my Fhoenix Suberpanel. We are now managing a few strides of a really lovely balanced canter.

People have always said she was an Olympia pony, if only she had a decent canter. If we can build on what we are getting now, she might just get there. If she ever does, it will be totally down to the Fhoenix. She had muscle atrophy either side of her spine when we bought her, and was impossible to fit with a treed saddle - it just bridged. No problem with the suber. Her back is improving all the time.

I would recommend the Fhoenix to anyone. I have been riding full time for over 30 years and have never sat on a saddle I felt so safe, comfortable and in tune with the horses back in.
If Bella, Jack and Grace could talk I know they would say the same.

The defense rests!!!!!

[SuzieP]

I'll be interested to see if they stand the test of time.....