Torsion treeless

[maggie]

I have no experience at all of treeless saddles, never even sat on one, but I've been offered a try of a Torsion.

I did investigate treeless before investing in my lovely WH treed saddle. All of the ones I saw (3) moved on the back of the horse so I thought they would be fine for a lightweight rider, but not for me (er....NOT a lightweight rider by the way ).

Two reasons for my interest:

Su bucks on an upward canter transition, especially out hacking, less frequently schooling and - the girl has a sense of occasion - never in a dressage test......YET! Nor does she do it when its her who wants to go faster, rather than me asking her. Both saddles - dressage and WH - are checked by a trusted saddler and fit well. Would a treeless make a difference?

I LOVE the idea of 1 saddle for every horse. Is this true?

I know there's a lot of expert opinion out there, so would be grateful for your pros and cons.

[Debbie]

I'll throw in my two cents for what its worth...keep in mind, I've utilized the Cashel soft saddle on a Missouri foxtrotter which is a very forwards moving horse, and the Ansur saddle.

With Nancy's Knight, the Ansur saddle seemed ultimately comfortable to him. Although I found via shiatsu a ridge across the loins that was sore, I believe this was down to a decorative quilted edging, and was removed from later designs.

The Cashel saddle, I did find moved considerably under me, especially as Lady Bear stretched out and move into the trademark Missouri foxtrot....ie the saddle migrated backwards.

If I'd kept with the saddle I probably would have needed to revert to some form of breastband to keep the saddle from migrating out from under me.

I'm no 'lightweight', weighing in at around 160 to 170lbs when I trialed the Cashel. The saddle did move with the gaited horse's action, and I believe my added weight. No one will want to admit it, but I did spot to 'dry' spots that corresponded to my seat bones as well. Note, this is the Cashel saddle, and it may have improved with later additions.

As for Su herself, I found her extremely light in the saddle and hand, but will admit, she was 'cantering towards her mates' when I first asked. Ironically, she was equally animated as we cantered back towards you, and 'whoa' did not work for her. She was well balanced, not rushing, not slowing, but did not quit until my memory banks came up with 'halt' for the command.

I have to admit, I adore your saddler!!! And would be pleased as punch with any saddle she wanted to plonk onto Blossom for me. I think we both concured the biggest problem with the English riders vs western is that English riders tend to ride 'on the neck'. That is, they are not placing the saddle itself well enough behind the shoulderblades to allow the natural action of the shoulders.

Now, I am NOT suggesting this is Su's problem. But perhaps your saddler can come up with a differnt suggestion?

I feel the western saddles for the most part are too long for the short coupled dales ponies, but perhaps the australain type saddles might offer a solution? (That is, if you can find them wide enough. In the US they offer the Aussie saddles in a 'draft' size).

Hope my prattling might be of help

[maggie]

thanks for your help here Debbie, it's interesting to get other people's opinions on Su, there's not that many people want to hop on board once they've seen her in action!

I'd forgotten about the 'riding on the neck' too, its certainly worth investigating that the saddle doesn't move forward, but the saddle marks don't seem to indicate that.

We have one Torsion saddle at the Unicorn Centre and I know it's used for certain riders to help them retain a more upright position, so it might be worth asking the instructors there.

I guess the only thing to do is try it and see.

[knight]

It's true that most treeless don't have panels underneath and may tend to be less stable, especially lateral stability as a result. I haven't ridden a torsion but I think I've read that they do recommend something like a sitko pad to provide stability. Giving it a try does sound like the best way to see. I've heard good things about the torsion, that they are well though out and well made. Will be interesting to give it a try and see what you think.

[harveydales]

I've also heard good things about the Torsion but the one time I had a little sit on one on Harvey, I felt SO unsafe that I had to get off immediately! Not sure why I felt like that. Interesting that the Unicorn Centre uses one.

I have tried a few different treeless saddles on Harvey and the only one I felt 100% secure in and Harvey went really well in at all paces was the HM Fhoenix. However, I found it sat me so wide that it caused me problems. It was very stable on Harvey though.

Strangely, I find most saddles, treed or treeless, tend to slip back on Harvey, not forward so that is something I have to watch for with him being so short backed.

I will be interested in what you think of the Torsion.

[Debbie]

maggie said:

thanks for your help here Debbie, it's interesting to get other people's opinions on Su, there's not that many people want to hop on board once they've seen her in action!

You're joking?? I found Su to be one of the better trained ponies I've ever encountered. She's exceedingly light in hand, pays attention to her rider, is a well balanced pony, and very well behaved. Hmmmm....maybe she was doing her utmost to impress the Yank visitor? She succeeded then, as I was impressed Duly.

I think the main thing is to find yourself a safe, enclosed arena and just go for it with the different saddles. That way the pony doesn't go HEY HO!!! And head for the hills if it doesn't work for you, and you'll get the opportunity to really give the saddle a decent workout.

I find you won't discover the kinks of many saddles until you've ridden a decent 45 minutes in them at least. The longer the ride, the more you'll find if it matches you and pony.

Su's a bit of a stoic from what I found, so she may keep quiet if something doesn't quite fit, but she thinks it'll 'do'. But I'm equally sure you'll knjow if something's really bothering her.